1. PRIOR TO CONCEPTION, WHAT WAS I?


MAHARAJ: He has no acquaintance whatsoever with the ego. So long as one identifies with form, the ego is there. Since a self-realized one no longer has any identification with the body form, the question simply does not arise. And what’s more: of his very existence he is not even aware.’ That means the self-realized principle witnesses the manifest principle, which is the life force together with the beingness. 

V: When one has no form, a person has no more problems? 

M: Not a line of the body touches him. That self-realized entity witnesses all the manifest, together with the world and also beingness. 

V: In the case of one who has self-realized, do all body actions happen spontaneously? 

M: All actions happen spontaneously. When the beingness was conceived, the body formation took place spontaneously around it; there was no question of building the body by someone. 

V: In the case of a jnani,’ one who is established in the Absolute, how can things happen around him for his sustenance? With a child, nature has provided parents so he can develop with their help, but the jnani has nobody around him. 

M: When the beingness was in the womb, formation of the body occurred spontaneously, did it not? Similarly in the case of a jnani since he is one with nature, he is nature itself, so it is the worry of nature to look after him; no personalities as such are required, everything just happens around him. 

V: There are all these great yogis who try to live for thousands of years. They hang upside down, live on air or just on water. What is it that interests them, and why are they living so long with so much suffering? 

M: They get some kind of satisfaction out of it, the fact that they are doing something spiritual, are doing penance. They want to prolong that and feel they have a certain duty by prolonging their life in the spiritual field. On what does this beingness depend? Because of what do you survive? This life does not continue. Why? When something goes wrong with the body, it comes to an end. You are confident that you are, but what does it depend on? And through what cause does this confidence, this beingness, disappear? In the process the beingness becomes “non-being.” And “non-being” in turn becomes spontaneously being. Now whom should we question as to how this happens? 

One has to investigate oneself. You have the faith “you are”; on what does it depend? Nobody investigates on these lines. Why this beingness, how am I, why am I, on what does it depend? This aspect is never considered; people consider only the relative factors concerning the body-mind, and the area beyond that they never look into. 

What do you mean by “death,” a common word, a com- mon parlance? This faith “I am” has disappeared, the confidence that “I am” is gone—that is death. 

V: Some people want to prolong their life; it means that they have self-love. Does it mean that they are within the limits of maya (illusion), or have they transcended it? 

M: Once you have transcended the body idea, it does not matter whether you live a short or a long time. You do not depend on anything for your existence. Try to find out for yourself what you are, without depending on anything or anyone. 

Whatever you want to think or ponder over, it is something other than the “you” you think of. You ever ponder over something which you are not! Then, how to think about yourself? This you cannot do. Perceiving this clearly, you become thought-free. Whatever you do, you think about something which is not you, even with a noble thought like Ishwara (God), which is still conceptual and therefore apart from yourself, Now, is it possible to think of one’s own Self, that is the question? 

V: You say that we should be independent of our functional being (i.e., the existence of body-mind), which I try to do, but somehow I cannot be independent of my health. 

M: You should ask questions about the subject we are dealing with. You ask gross and irrelevant questions. I am dealing with a topic where one has to ponder on oneself; there is no scope for words (concepts). Also, when there are no words there are no thoughts. 

What were you doing, eight days before conception in the womb of your mother, do you know or do I? Explain to me the situation prior to entering the womb, how were you? Only you can say anything about that state. 

V: I do not remember, but. . . I was beingness? 

Translator: Beingness comes in the womb. Beingness in a dormant condition, in the fetus in the mother’s womb. 

M: Who knows about the beingness before conception? If you had been aware of the beingness before conception, you would not have cared to enter the womb. 

V: I do not remember. 

M: It is not possible because it is a nonattentive state. So, where is the question of remembering? With beingness, attention starts later. Beingness comes in the womb in a dormant condition. That borderline between being and “non- being” is moolamaya. Glorious names are given to it. Initially, there is no attention, and suddenly attention begins. 

Here is an article [Maharaj shows his cigarette lighter]; before it came into existence, what was its name? From “non-being” into the being state, how was it observed? You just felt that touch. Before observing anything, we feel the touch of “I am.” 

To realize that state prior to conception, that eternal state, whatever that state is, to abide in that is the highest. Now, for your sake, I attach a name to it, the Parabrabman state—the Absolute. 

V: Before conception? 

M: Before conception, whatever state exists, that is your most natural perfect state, it always prevails. When this beingness goes, that state will still be there, it ever prevails. 

The state in which you were eight days prior to conception and millions of years back, whatever it was, that state prevails and now also it does, and after the departure of the beingness it still prevails! 

Because of my present state of health, I am not inclined to talk much. Dealing only with this topic, only a rare person will understand what I am driving at. When someone asks me some gross questions, do you expect me to come down to that level and explain all details as if in a kindergarten class? 

I have some very strange questions! Before my birth, at my conception, who pulled me into the womb? My father? My mother? And in what form? That would be a possibility provided I had a certain form, color or design prior to conception; then only could I have been pulled inside. The one who has solved this riddle comes to the conclusion that this beingness and this entire manifest world is unreal. 

There is no need for knowledge when this beingness was not. When even great gods like Brahma and Vishnu were confronted with this puzzle, they closed their eyes and went into samadhi and just disappeared. 

V: They did nothing? 

M: What could they do? At present you feel “you are” because of the association with the vital breath; because the vital breath is operating, you know “you are.” When the association is not there, what can you do? Can you actually do anything? 

V: What can I do to acquire knowledge? M: Do nothing except hold on to yourself, just be in that beingness, then it will tell you how beingness turns into “non-beingness.” Therefore, I tell you just one thing: Catch hold of that touch of “I-am-ness” only, that beingness, dwell on it, and contemplate on that only. 

V: The best thing to do is to be there in that “I am” state? To be is meditation? 

M: There is no “be there,” just be. V: Is it possible the whole day? Any special meditation? 

M: Who says for the whole day? Who else can say for the whole day except the beingness? It can capture everything in this contemplation, but it cannot capture itself. 

V: Is karma a problem which we create? 

M: The one which has created you has created this karma and the problems of karma, so that you involve yourself in it. Who has created you? What do you mean by karma? It is movement, activity. 

V: As long as one is subject to karma, one encounters it and it appears as something real. But is it not actually an illusion? 

M: I try to keep you trapped as though you were in the womb. If you listen to me carefully and quietly, everything will be sprouting. It is a common mistake, a blunder, that we have become identified with the body form. 

V: The last mistake? 

M: The first and the last. Again remember the words which I have spoken earlier. The seed which has created this body and everything else, so long as it is alive, moist, you will explain these words. Once that seed is gone, you are in eternity only, in your eternal state. 

Out of a very small seed a very big tree grows into the sky. Similarly this small seed, this beingness—“I-am-ness” touch—out of that seed all this manifest world is created. At this point there is no energy left in the words; therefore, you cannot further express it verbally. 

V: My ego, my body, the other bodies of the egos here in this room, what they are hearing are all concepts, movements in this beingness. Is this correct? 

M: Yes, if you want to understand more clearly, take the example of a dream, your dream. Since I am touching on the highest aspects of knowledge, I am not in a position to reply to any gross questions. If somebody talks, or asks questions, 

I am not going to challenge him, because to him, from his standpoint and from his level, those are correct questions. Right now, if I have to be interested in a state at all, it is that state eight days prior to conception, the Parabrahman state. Yesterday the word “ego” was used, as also today. On what level is this “ego” attached, and when? 

Everything is most sacred and most unsacred. The question of sacred and unsacred is there so long as that beingness is there. If the beingness is not, where is the question of sacredness or non-sacredness? 

You meet some persons and call them very knowledgeable. They will tell you that in the next birth you will be a great king and in the birth after that a still greater king. When such advice is given, the listener is very happy, very contented. Self-love is the underlying illusion, but nobody wants to admit that. Nobody wants to give up his beingness, his “I am” knowledge. 

Suppose the following question is directed to an intelligent person: “Prior to conception, how were you?” This per- son would reply as follows: “I was in a dormant condition in the essences of my parents.” That would be how a smart person would reply. It is, however, based on the conventional 

outlook and if you trace it further to the parents’ parents, etc., you will have an infinite regression on your hands. Therefore, this principle, which has no form but is only the knowledge in a dormant condition, if you trace it to its source it goes back to eternity. That is why the principle is eternal. Now I will give you two clues for further investigation. One is to establish yourself in that state prior to conception, and the other is that you wrap yourself up in the traditional concept of the parents. In the latter case, you will fail to get a good grip on the true nature of yourself. The conventional knowledge is not destroyed but there is no need for it, because basically it is unreal, it is untruth. Whatever an ignorant child or an accomplished sage says, both are correct. 

I can give you another concept: “Who is the perfect principle or the personality that existed prior to the birth of anybody?” Here again is a similarity between a child in the cradle and a perfect jnani. When the child tastes food, he does not know whether it is urine or fecal material, food or milk, all these things having the same taste for him. 

How does the child know himself in that state? Only he knows. Now what do you want to say about the child and the jnani? 

V: I believe it is important to become a child, to drop all the attachments. 

M: Where is the question of giving up, renouncing everything? It has come about spontaneously, you do not have to throw out anything. You have to understand only. You are compelled to suffer or experience only because of the appearance of the beingness. Did you go and catch hold of the beingness? It has come about spontaneously. Is the child catching hold of something, has he caught any concepts, ideas or an ego? A jnani having understood this state of beingness and all its play, has transcended it and abides in the state prior to conception. He dwells ever in that perfect state, whether the beingness appears or disappears. 

During your life you have accomplished so many things, you had so many identities and all these identities and that understanding have left you. Finally, with what identity will you die? 

If you have understood what “you” really are, is there any necessity for spiritual pursuits? 

V: In reality, no. I ask myself why I am here, what is the reason? I know only too well there is ignorance in me. I think the reason J came here is to get help to destroy that ignorance. 

M: Your ignorance is gone. Now, describe, what do you mean by ignorance? 

V: I do not perceive it clearly enough, although I see many things. Sometimes I have problems; I think it is because of my ignorance. 

M: The waking state, sleep, beingness, all this experience combined, is ignorance only. That ignorance termed as “birth” means these three. Once you know this, you can do anything, you are free. When you know the false as false, then you do not have to worship at all. Any idea of doership—that things happen because you do something—also goes away. 

Prior to the appearance of this beingness, you were purely Parabrabman, the Absolute. 

The jnani does not give importance to this waking, sleep- ing and beingness. Just as you are not afraid of a serpent made out of rubber, so in a similar way the jnani has no interest in this waking state and beingness. 

V: Is it all the same? 

M: Will you make use of this knowledge? To see and affirm it as false, need you make any effort? 

V: You can see anything without effort. M: Once you know the ignorance, then there is no effort, because you have dismissed it as ignorance and there is no registration of it for future reference. 

What are you suffering or experiencing? The name of this body form and its associations and that beingness. If you ponder over it, you will have the instant solution. 

V: You have talked about the state of conception. Also that we are in the eternal Parabrabman state; but what is karma, is it a variant of that eternal state? 

M: There is no karma in the state of Parabrahman. Where is the question of karma? 

V: But you were talking about conception, body-mind. 

M: Who has entered the body-mind form? 

Now the space has entered in this room, the space is there. Why and how has the space entered this room? 

V: At first there was no space...no time? 

M: The space is outside, the space is here also; there is no distinction between outside and inside space, it is all space only! So where is the question of coming and going? 


January 8th 1980 

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