
VISITOR: It seems to me that whenever a form is infused with life, consciousness is produced, which ~ appears by reflection of awareness in matter. Should it not be the other way around?
MAHARAJ: Whatever you say is all right from the body-mind state. When the sense of being is cleansed from its body-mind state, then it is universal. This is the source for the creation of the five elements, three gunas, followed by the vegetable and animal kingdoms.
V: There is prana, the vital force in plants. Is there also consciousness in plants?
M: All that is seen and perceived in space is the creation of consciousness and is infused with it. The entire created world of form will finally merge into space. From the bodily stand- point, all forms appear as separate entities. But at the con- sciousness level, they are the consciousness-manifest and not separate.
As you make spiritual progress, you will realize that the source of the universe is your consciousness only. At present, you are in the grip of the discursive intellect, because of your identity with a body; therefore you are unable to understand. Whatever knowledge you now collect is from this identity, but that is not true knowledge. But when you have the knowledge about “what you are,” you will understand that the very world and universe are contained in the speck of your consciousness only. At this stage you would have transcended your body-mind sense. But today, whatever knowledge you acquire is through your firm belief that you are the body-mind,
When you see the “inner” world as something external, you term it a “dream.” But what is it that is perceived inside? It is contained in the sense that “you are,” in your consciousness. Exactly the same process takes place in the waking state also.
Your consciousness, the sense of presence, is the very shell in which the waking world or the dream-world proliferates.
This is the actual state of affairs. But you accept all that you see with your body sense; and whatever you perceive is through the inadequate yardstick of your limited intellect. Whatever is visible or perceptible is an outcome of space only. When all that disappears, again space prevails. When your world concretizes out of space and in space, you term all that with various names and titles for your convenience, to carry out your day-to-day activities. In reality, no such names and titles exist. None of such creations has any authoritative, valid form or individuality of its own.
To realize this you must accomplish jnana-yoga, which means: the self subsiding in the Self. Again, jnana-yoga means to inquire how this “I-am-ness” and the world came about. To realize that “I-am-ness” and the world are one is jnana-yoga. Here, the knowledge “I am” should subside in itself.
But all you really want is to keep your body-mind sense intact; that just will not do. Thus, to realize that “I-am-ness” means the manifest world and the universe is the very fulfill- ment of jnana-yoga.
When the sense of being appears, it has no body sense. Out of that sense of being, the whole cosmos is created. In that creation you also have a form, but you accept body as your identity and move about and function in the world. The principle that motivates and enlivens the body is the sense of beingness only, but it is not the body. All this play in the cosmos and the world functions in the consciousness, and finally the play will merge into consciousness. Ponder over this without identifying with the body, and you, the consciousness, will know that accepting the form as identity is maya, illusion. Thus, the consciousness is the very seed-principle of the entire cosmos. It comprises the dynamic life force, guna, which is the quality of beingness, and prana or vital breath. Consciousness gives the knowledge that “you are.” When the consciousness first appears it is free from identification of any kind with “this” or “that.” Even though being the dynamic manifest universal principle, due to its identification with the body it suffers pain and pleasure. The consciousness knows itself through itself. Only a rare one realizes that the entire cosmos manifestation springs out of one’s seed-consciousness. From atma-yoga, only vis-vayoga—that is, one’s unity with the cosmos—is realized when one unites with oneself. The self abiding in the Self is the jnana-yoga which is a nameless and formless state, but later whatever manifests itself assumes a name and form. By merely acquiring knowl- edge one cannot claim to be a jnani. The jnana-yogi is not required to know anything as he is knowledge itself. Jnana-yoga is the highest state in spirituality. In this state there is no individuality, as this is the all-pervading state. Rarely will someone put a question from this standpoint and rarer still will there be someone who will answer these questions. The sense of individuality and needs are felt prior to jnana-yoga. But after the accomplishment of jnana-yoga, one is beyond needs and individual personality. Kundalini-yoga experts revel in the visions and powers obtained through yoga but will not expound the source of kundalini energy.
V: I quite agree that we shall reach the highest level. But you have said that from the highest suddenly springs “I-am-ness.” Thus we are at the root of a total mystery.
M: What is the source prompting you to speak of levels and to think of reaching the highest level?
Level is only a concept. As a result of separation from the Highest, the primary concept “I am” arose and subsequently other concepts developed. Separation means otherness, duality.
V: I thought I heard you say that there is total non-differentiation at the supreme level. On that supreme level is there also total “I-am-ness”?
M: Out of “non-knowingness,” knowingness appears: this knowingness should realize itself. When we speak, we should investigate from where the language arises. It sprouts from the sense of “I-am-ness,” but what is the source of this “I-am-ness”?
Actually I do not talk; only when occurring spontaneously does the talk express itself. But the primary occurrence is the reminder “I am,” out of which springs the language and the talk. So, what is this “I-am-ness”?
Remember that in the primary reminder “I am” the whole cosmos and your body exist. All bodies are created from and sustained on material (biological) essences, but the sense of being is the quintessence, sattva-guna, of the body. Who and from where is this sense of being? This has to be thoroughly investigated. When this is done, while abiding necessarily in the knowledge “I am”—the sense of beingness—an amazing revelation will be made, namely that from your own seed-beingness the whole manifest universe is projected, including your body. This supreme and powerful principle, though being itself without a form and name, upon sensing “I am” instantly embraces the body and mistakenly accepts this as its own. It clings to the body-identity so quickly that the fact of its own independent existence is easily missed.
The essence of being, which is humming “I am,” is a prerequisite for any functioning of the body. When a person is sick and there is no response when the patient is called or beckoned, this sense of being is clouded.
V: Should one fall asleep as many times as possible in order to experience “I-am-ness” in the waking state?
M: “J-am-ness” cannot be experienced or recognized from the body-mind sense. It is the “I-am-ness” that makes the body and senses function and experience.
You are quite knowledgeable; now understand this: if you think you are dying, it shows you still identify with your body and that your knowledge “I am” has not merged in itself, which also indicates that you have not attained jnana-yoga.
Your spiritual knowledge, therefore, smacks of impurity. While you are actually the manifest knowledge “I am,” you cling to a body as yourself. This is the impurity. We talked about death, which is the end point of life; but what about the starting point, the birth? Prior to birth you were in the womb for nine months. During that period, did you have humkara -— the humming of beingness? Immediately after birth, the indwelling beingness does not yet feel itself palpably. After a few months, recognition starts. Still later the child begins to know various objects, such as his body and his mother, as also sounds and words. At this stage, through the mother, he knows his name and other ideas.
You as a fetus, did you know yourself in the womb of the mother?
V: But there was no consciousness in that form.
M: Was it knowing itself in those nine months in the womb?
V: No, but it was there.
M: Consciousness is all-prevailing, but it remained dormant in the fetus because it was not a fully developed body.
V: But it was in the fetus.
M: Where is the argument? Consciousness is everywhere, it is in the flowers, you, me, everywhere!
V: Good, good, I have understood.
M: What did you understand?
V: That there is nothing else but consciousness.
M: No, this is not it. The correct understanding will be when you realize that whatever you have understood so far, is invalid. With the fulfillment of jnana-yoga, all that which is understood is made unreal.
The so-called sages who revel in powers obtained, and in the honor received as a result, are not fully realized because their abidance in the Self is not complete. A child, who was unblemished, is fed with ideas, just as the blank screen of a T.V. set displays pictures transmitted from the outside. The child principle, which is consciousness, is the product of a “chemical process.” I like to refer to consciousness as “chemical.” But You, at the highest level, are not that chemical in which all the world drama happens. Suppose you are a hundred-year-old who holds on to this memory that he is a hundred years old. It is the chemical. For example, look at the picture of my guru on the wall here. Now who is holding on to the image of my guru? It is the “chemical” of the photograph.
Now this “chemical” in the body holds on to an identity and carries out activities through the body. I call this expression “mechanical.”
V: But the “chemical” photograph could not have retained the picture of your guru if he had not been there.
M: But who is this guru and where would this memory “I am” as well as the “chemical” be if the Highest, that is the Absolute, was not there? The eternal existence of the Absolute alone makes the appearance of consciousness and all world-play possible, so the world-play is an image created by consciousness.
V: Has universal consciousness taken the form of Maharaj?
M: That speck of consciousness has taken the form of uni- versal consciousness. Its image is the entire universe, just like the pinprick of consciousness in deep sleep develops into a dream-world.
V: Does it mean that you are in my dream-world?
M: Before referring to “me” as “you,” investigate as to what “you” are. Just as a boomerang hits the person who throws it, similarly your own question has bounced back on you, so “you”—what is that? And what is more, I am not the body, nor that “chemical” even.
This “chemical” or the consciousness is also called maba- tattva, moolamaya, biranyagarbha, brahma-sutra etc....but the sum total of all this is the atma-prem, the love of the Self. The one who understands and realizes the maba-tattva is called the “Mahatma.” Presumptuously, you may think you are a jnani, but if you think so you are an ignorant person only.
V: So the Awareness is the highest possible term used. Awareness appears to be above “I-am-ness.”
M: Yes, provided Awareness does not feel “I-am-ness.” The knowledge of the entire universe merges into that highest state. Whatever qualitative manifestation is there, it is called Bhagavan. All the titles and statuses suggested by the titles, and everything else, have merged into Nothingness. The Ishwara which has become the visvavishaya—that is, the universal manifestation—has become nirvishaya—that is, one without the subjectivity even. This can be understood only by those who are extremely keen to know their own nature. Whatever information I give is about that spark, the speck of consciousness, which has delivered this manifest universe. Further, I the Absolute am not that speck. But I cannot give any information about Me, the Absolute. There have been so many dissolutions of cosmoses and universes, so also aeons have come and gone, but I the Absolute remain untouched, and my kingdom is ever quiet. Suppose a question is asked of you, what were you a hundred years back? You would reply “I was not.” That means, I was not like “this,” that is, like this present “I am.” Who (and how) could (he) say “I was not like this”? The one who says this, was he not there? The one who was prior to a hundred years was not like this present “I am” but he was and is now.
V: He is this “I,” the Absolute.
M: All right, use whatever words and concepts you like and satisfy yourself. When I call someone a “cheat,” it satisfies me, and also I call someone a “Mahatma” because it satisfies me. What were you a hundred years ago? Ponder over it.
Why do you not investigate the point of conception and its further development? Instead, you are too busy acquiring spiritual and worldly gains. That will not help.
In the vegetable juices and food essences this svarasa, sense of knowingness, and prarabdba, destiny, exist already in dormant condition. And the quintessence of the food essences and juices is the sense of being or the knowledge “I am.
V: But could that principle be there without prana?
M: Who should be there without prana?
V: Is it in the flower?
M: Not only in flowers but even in the color. It is everywhere. After listening to the knowledge that I am expounding, what will happen? One who understands and imbibes the knowledge will come to the conclusion that whatever is seen, heard, experienced and acquired is totally useless and redundant. Finally, no one will remain but the nishkama Parabrahman, the desireless eternal Absolute state. We go on with spiritual disciplines such as worshipping a God, penance, japa etc. to acquire something spiritual. And if the purpose is attained, it will be nishkama Parabrahman, which proves everything is useless. Even the highest is useless to the highest. This state is also titled Poorna-brahman, Paramatman, and Parameshvara. Now go back one day prior to your conception. That is also the Poorna-brahman state; there was no need for anything then.
V: I try to follow my thoughts and feelings, but I find that they are changing all the time. I know this changing happens against a background of the changeless in me. Will this way of thinking be useful to me?
M: Yes, it will be useful but...Intellectually it is all right, but the thinking is unreal. What do you mean by the changeless? When could there be the changeless? Only when you do not know “you are”...when the sense of being totally merges in itself. Were you not in that changeless state, a day prior to your conception? From your body-mind sense you observe everything as separate entities, such as “I,” “you,” “we,” “they,” etc. But to the changeless Absolute all this play of cosmos and universe happens in the cell of beingness. Which identity has remained unchanged from childhood to your present age? No identity in the world can ever remain the same and unchanging!
V: I think the “I principle” does not change, is it not so?
M: Your “I principle” has still not understood. It is the product of the five-elemental play, which is always in a state of flux. So how can you attribute the quality of “I-am-ness” to the Absolute state? In that state there is no scope at all for any play of the five elements! It is a state without any attributes.
Suppose the Absolute had a little sense of this “I-am-ness,” would it care to enter a womb?
V: During my meditation, attention is on consciousness itself. I realize I am aware of that pure consciousness and so I am not it.
M: Your spiritual background is good. You talk about pure consciousness which is all-pervading manifestation and functioning. And in this state witnessing happens. The fulfillment of meditation rests in totally obliterating the memory and non-memory of manifestation along with the sense of being. So long as the guna, sense of being, is there, witnessing happens. Abidance in the non-witnessing state is the advaita state, the highest; therefore, all experience must be swallowed, including the feeling of the sense of being, which is the primordial experience.
V: As I have said earlier, when I am aware of that pure consciousness, at that point I am quite independent of my body and circumstances. I feel myself, the Absolute, as the origin of that consciousness. And behind this consciousness, the “I” as Absolute remains in silent repose.
M: You are talking of consciousness, now tell me: What is the cause of this consciousness? It is the result of what, the product of what?
SECOND VISITOR: Consciousness is a product of food.
M: Yes, in the food essence, in this quality or guna, the sense of “I-am-ness” dwells. But understand clearly, you or I are not that guna from the Absolute standpoint. We, the Absolute, are only posing as “I-am-ness”; as the Absolute, we are not that chemical “I am.”
First Visitor: Later in my meditation I seem to move away from my state of awareness of pure consciousness and slide back into bodily and mental existence. I seek your help at this point.
M: Do nothing, absolutely nothing! Just be, be the knowledge “I am” only and abide there.
To imbibe this, meditate on beingness only. Catch hold of the knowledge “I am” in meditation. In this process, the realization occurs that “I” the Absolute am not the guna “I am”; therefore, in meditation nothing is to be retained as memory. Nevertheless, something will appear on the memory screen, but be unconcerned; just be, do nothing. Refrain from grasping anything in meditation; the moment you do, otherness begins, and so duality. Nothing is to be done. Then all your riddles will be solved and dissolved. Moolamaya—that is, the primary illusion—will release her stronghold on you and will get lost.
In spirituality there is no profit or loss, so also there will be no question of birth and death. As a matter of fact, you have no direct experience of birth! It is something like the incident of robbery that happened in Calcutta and of which I, residing in Bombay and never having been to Calcutta, am accused. Similarly, I am charged, not only with this birth but also hundreds of previous births. I am not aware of any birth; only my “parents,” whom I never knew, are charging me with this birth.
With this state of affairs, are you not ashamed of accept- ing the “charge” of your birth? I was absolved of all these imaginary charges, when I met my sat-guru, who lit the torch of wisdom and showed me my true nature as the Unborn. In the domain of the Unborn there is no place for the “I am” nor for the sun, the moon, the stars, the cosmos etc.
February 10th 1980