4. NOTHING EVER INTERFERES WITH THE FIVE-ELEMENTAL PLAY


VISITOR: What is ego? Why does it think about itself all the time? 

MAHARAJ: First you have what is called aham-bhava—that is, the “I-am” sense. Later, this sense identifies with the form of a body, when it is called aham-akar, the “I am” form. This is ego. 

V: Why does it not disappear in people? They feel they are the doers and they want to be loved. 

M: It is the natural outcome of the three gunas. While the body is the product of food essence, it is the medium through which all these three gunas function. Ego is the very nature of these gunas. While a man thinks that he is the doer, even though he does no action, in reality all activities are due to the gunas; only a jnani realizes this and transcends the ego. Ego is never a title or a name, but just a sense of “I am” prior to words. The waking state, the sleep state and the knowingness “I am” constitute an ego. In the absence of these three states, what do you think you are? What would be the evidence for your existence? 

V: Could the ego not be due to thoughts? 

M: These three states are the natural outcome of the beingness or “I-am-ness.” One who recognizes beingness transcends all the three gunas, namely sattva—consciousness; rajas—dynamic quality; and tamas—claiming doership. But for the manifestation of consciousness a food body is absolutely necessary. Without such a body, there cannot be consciousness, the three gunas, nor even the three states— waking, sleep and knowingness. 

V: Do your refer to consciousness as “mental” consciousness? 

M: Where does the mind come in, when we talk about the three states? Without waking, deep sleep and knowingness, where is the mind? You do not know “you are” without consciousness. 

V: Could it be then that thoughts appear in consciousness? 

M: [Pointing to the burning incense stick] Yes, when the incense stick burns, the fragrance will be there. What do you mean by birth? It means: birth of the waking state, deep sleep and knowingness. But the material for this birth is the quintessence of the food body. If you have any questions, by all means ask. But who will take care of your questions, if you are not? If you are not, where can be your questions, even those relating to your birth and death? 

V: Birth happens only to the body. 

M: But when you refer to the body, is it not the quintessence of the food essence? 

V: What causes the ego to expand sometimes with age, and with the deterioration of the body, as in paranoids? 

Ego seems to increase with age. 

M: But of what is ego the product? Whatever experience you undergo, it is the product of beingness, and beingness is the outcome of food. From food is derived the body form and from the body essence is derived the birth. What else do you want? With the appearance of beingness, the title of birth is given to you; that is, you are accused of having been born. 

With such replies, your questions and talk lose all significance. Now tell me who is talking? Are you doing the talking or is it the quality of beingness that is talking? 

V: There never is an “I” that is talking. 

M: You still do not grasp what I say. The seed of world-experience is the beingness. Where is the “I” in all this? The talking is done by the beingness. But it is dependent upon the body essence, which is the product of food. When the food essence in the body loses its quality, beingness becomes weak and death is feared. [A visitor mumbles something inaudible.] Use any words you like, but express yourself; you have written books, but what information did you give in them? “I am” or “I am not” relates to the beingness. All the words are spoken by the beingness. If the sense “I am” is not, which means if the beingness is not, who is there to say “I am”? 

V: I never had the idea that I was writing a book. 

M: What is the use of discussing with you? There is no point in your denying what I said. What are you, and what could you be without the three states, waking, deep sleep and the knowingness “I am”? 

V: Therefore I deny that I am doing anything. 

M: But there appears to be some assertiveness in your talking. Please do not try to talk merely for the sake of talking. If you would quietly listen, everything will be revealed. When anybody comes here, I know that the person does not have an iota of knowledge. People bring me presents. But this is a disease, and “I” am not into that. Similarly, in our life, physical and spiritual disciplines and rituals are prescribed, but I am ever out of these conditionings. This is absolutely clear to me. 

This Chinese carpet, said to be worth more than four thousand rupees, has been presented to me. But I have no feelings about it at all. Similarly, I am not the least concerned with the so-called “birth” imposed on me. The birth relates to the three gunas, the three states and the beingness, and I am not all that. 

I use the carpet, but I am not the carpet. In the same way I use the beingness. Persons visiting this place fall at my feet out of respect; but the respect is shown to the quality of beingness, and I am unapproachable. 

All this spiritual knowledge pertains to the realm of beingness, and it is bound to go like a guest. The question is, where, when and how will you have the ultimate knowledge? 

V: Who has this ultimate knowledge? 

M: Nobody has the self-knowledge. The knowledge “I am” is not the Absolute state. 

The beingness, comprising the three gunas, is given the godly titles of Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesh. Brahma is the creator, Vishnu is the preserver, and Mahesh is the destroyer, and the combination of these three gods is worshipped and praised by us when singing bbajans. But all these gods subside and go to rest in a self-realized sage, termed as jnani. The state of a jnani transcends the sense of time and even the sublime emotions. That highest state is given the title of Parabrabman, Paramatman etc. 

After reading spiritual books, people argue over their interpretation. But what is the point of such quarrels? All these talks go on in the realm of beingness, and You, the Ultimate, are not the beingness. 

V: Yesterday, Maharaj asked me to meditate on when the beingness appeared. Questions could also be asked about the state after the appearance of beingness—such as why, when, how, and so forth. 

M: Yes, these questions can only be asked after the beingness appears, and the beingness will remain so long as the food essence is available. Why and when does a person die? When the food essence is not supplied, function of the person’s body ceases and the indwelling beingness disappears. This is called “death.” But who did die? 

V: One object died. 

M: But who says this? Can it be the one who died? If not, who says it? 

V: You can see it from day to day, that this beingness appears and disappears. Something else must be there. 

M: The ultimate seer cannot see by seeing; but without seeing, the seer sees. But that ultimate seer does not belong to the realm of the beingness. 

V: It appears to me that seeing itself is seen. 

M: But what is the cause of this? It is the beingness only— the three-aspected sattva-guna. If you do not understand, please keep quiet. 

The Absolute cannot be understood. 

Whatever you understand, you are not that. In non- understanding, you understand yourself. 

V: Then how can the three gunas be responsible for the witnessing? 

M: [Addressing a new visitor, with a beard] You have grown and maintained a beard like a Mahatma. Come on, ask questions. 

V: You talked about a jnani. Does he think? Can he be without feelings? 

M: For the purpose of communicating, he has to employ such words as “the jnani is thinking” or “the jnani is talking” etc. 

V: But actually nothing of the sort is there. It is reassuring that he talks about thinking and that he is feeling. 

M: The jnani is beyond the attributes of the three gunas and is beyond emotions. How can a jnani be involved in thinking and emotions? 

V: I see a difference between thinking and emotions. By feelings, I mean those which are like the stream of a river; they come and go. 

M: Yes, this appearance and disappearance of the feelings and emotions is the very nature of the three gunas, and not yours. 

V: I understand this is a natural outflow of the gunas and nothing of the Absolute. 

M: You are convinced about nothingness, but of whom? Are you convinced that a jnani is Nothing or the knowledge “I am” is nothing? The knowledge “I am” is nothing. That knowledge is like a guest; it comes and goes. You have come here; you are very clever. Now what did happen? All the knowledge, which you had collected elsewhere and brought here, is rendered useless and redundant. [Pointing to two visitors] The knowledge of these two will become useless. At present, they are the very ocean of knowledge. But when their three gunas and beingness disappear, all their knowledge also disappears. So long as beingness is there, all the worldly activities will go on. But you now realize that “You” are neither the activities in the beingness nor the beingness. “You,” as the Absolute, are none of these. 

V: To meditate on that which comes after the beingness . . . The only way I see it, is to watch what remains, when every- thing is gone. When time, space and everything disappear, what remains? 

M: When the manifest world of the three gunas is gone, whatever remains indicates what you were a hundred years ago and prior to your birth. In that state, “You” were bereft of the three states of waking, deep sleep and knowingness. You should abide in that state during meditation. 

V: How does one avoid going into samadhi in this meditation? 

M: Going into samadhi or coming out of samadhi are not your qualities. You are beyond qualities. 

V: My question is how to avoid it. 

M: Going into, and coming out of, a samadbi are qualities like all other qualities of the three gunas. And do not try to avoid samadhi. It is the natural play of the three gunas. Samadhi will be there but “You,” the Absolute, are not in the samadhi. 

V: I used to have these tendencies, so my guru forbade me meditation and observation. 

M: But could you tell me, how and where “You” were introduced to the knowledge “you are”? Did your guru tell you that? Where and how did the union of the beingness and the Absolute take place? 

V: The question never did arise. 

M: One ignorant person can tell another ignorant person anything. But that one who recognizes what the ignorance is, should be considered as the knower, the jnani. Many people presume themselves to be jnanis, but they are ignorant only. One person says “I am knowledgeable,” another says “I know,” but both are ignorant. 

The waking state is followed by deep sleep, and deep sleep is followed by the waking state, and so on goes the cycle. This cycle constitutes the beingness. 

You must be very alert, as at a time when someone aims a rifle at you and you are trying to avoid the bullet. It is not child’s play to see through the ignorance. 

V: I will try. 

M: Are you going to ask questions from without the three states or within the three states? 

V: By using the three states. M: Then, what's the use? Earlier you wanted to stay here for three weeks. Do you still want to stay for that period? Is it necessary? 

V: Earlier Maharaj asked me a question and I answered. But once my purpose is achieved I may go. 

M: Is there anything left that you have not accomplished? And what do you mean by “purpose”? 

V: May I know how to deal with the purpose completely and consciously? 

M: The process of attaining the purpose is within the three gunas, whereas the purpose itself is beyond the three gunas. 

V: The process of attaining the purpose then disappears? 

M: The meditator involved in that process is not the real one, but the target is the real. 

V: [Pointing to a book] This is the final obstacle. SECOND VisIToR: What is the value of a book? 

M: A book is valuable to its reader provided he is more ignorant than its author. The author has very beautifully written ignorance in his book, and we are so engrossed in it that we go to sleep. 

V: But after reading that book many have come to you. 

M: Why have they come? 

V: It was to get direction for their meditation. 

M: With the transcendence of the knowledge “I am,” the Absolute prevails. The state is called Parabrahman, while the knowledge “I am” is termed Brahman. This knowledge “I am” or the beingness is illusion only. Therefore, when Brahman is transcended only the Parabrahman is, in which there is not even a trace of the knowledge “I am.” 

When those three states—waking, deep sleep and know- ingness—were not there, could there be beingness? Why? In that state did your beingness arise? Would there be any necessity for beingness in the Parabrahman state? In the absence of beingness, did “You” see the sun, the moon and the stars in the firmament? In that state, was there any benefit from the sun, the moon and the stars? 

The beingness is a superimposition, a cloak of illusion over the Absolute. In other words, the beingness, which is the very first and primary concept “I am,” is itself the conceptual illusion. 

This manifest world is the dynamic play of the five elements. In that there is no scope for an individual. A diamond radiates light all around; it is radiance itself. In deeper meditation, you will realize that, like the brilliance emanating from a diamond in all directions, the manifest world emanates out of you; it is your effulgence only. 

V: Like an old-fashioned cafe having mirrors on the walls, which reflect your manifold images. 

M: The whole universe manifests in that principle, which is termed beingness or birth. This beingness illumines all that exists, which means the entire universe manifests as the body of the beingness. 

On a television screen, you see different forms, images and landscapes, but they are all the expression or play of the tube’s electron beams only. Similarly, the entire manifest world of your purview is the product of your beingness. 

When you go into deep quietude, after thorough comprehension of these talks, you will observe that in the knowledge “you are” innumerable universes and cosmoses latently exist. [Maharaj pointing to the foreigners] These are seekers of the true knowledge, while the local people follow devotion to a god, so that their mundane needs are provided. I have therefore the highest regard for the foreigners, because whatever they undertake they see it through to the very end. I admire their perseverance. 

V: To come here, many of us have left all the profound acharyas completely. 

M: Such spiritual personages do not belong to any country. They are the product of the five-elemental play. People take birth and die in the play of the consciousness. In the next hundred years all these people will die and a fresh crop of visitors will arrive in the world, in a continuous process. This too is the play of the five elements. Many acharyas have come and gone, but none could bring about even a little change in the process of creation, preservation and destruction—the play of the five elements. Not only acharyas, even great incarnations like Rama, Krishna and others, could not do it. The same can be said of the rishis, sages, and siddhapurushas—the souls highly evolved spiritually. 

Inexorably the great drama goes on, although it is gov- erned by such an odious principle as: “One species preys upon another species.” 

There are organizations to prevent cruelty to animals, but they only prolong the life and sufferings of animals. Could they bring to a stop animal creation? As a result of this creation, both the human beings and animals suffer in this world. Is there any progress in “family-planning” either in human beings or in animals in totality? 

What authority does one have about oneself? People have no authority whatsoever to interfere in this grand drama of the five elements, to effect any change, because their primary nature ever remains the same. 


January 15th 1980 

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